Two Egyptian TV hosts recently clashed live on air over the question who should be held accountable for the Brussels terrorist attacks. Rania Al-Badawi said that the West was responsible for the rise of ISIS and Al-Qaeda, while Amr Adeeb countered that this ideology stemmed from within Islam itself. "I know you are not comfortable with the truth," he said, but "they are from among us!" Emotions ran high on the show, which aired on Al-Yawm TV on March 22, 2016.
Following are excerpts
Rania Al-Badawi: You've said that the most popular article was titled: "Why do They Hate Us?" This question means that they view this as one religion against all the others, or claim that the Muslims carry out all the bombings. First of all, there are statistics that show that many of the bombings and killings in recent years were carried out by non-Muslims. These attacks were no less significant than those carried out by the Muslims.
We are Muslims, but we don't hate the [Westerners], or anything. We get our mobile phones from the West, and we go shopping there. It is not the Muslims or Islam that hate them. This is something that they [in the West] have nurtured. It was the Americans who created Al-Qaeda and nurtured it, in order to use it to fight the USSR. ISIS was created for reasons pertaining to the region and to the security of Israel. Today or yesterday, Hillary Clinton and all the presidential candidates talked about what they would do for the security of Israel.
After the [West] displaced them and they went to Europe, they talk about Germany and France hosting the refugees! It is you who made them refugees in the first place!
Amr Adeeb: The situation right now is that there are Muslims at large who want to kill the world. I know that you are not comfortable with the truth, and that people will say that they are not Muslims, they are not among us… No way! They are from among us! The people who kill us here in Egypt are also from among us!
Rania Al-Badawi: So from where did the British or French Muslims adopt their ideology?
Amr Adeeb: From Islam!
Rania Al-Badawi: What do you mean "from Islam"?! This does not stem from Islam.
Amr Adeeb: Face up to yourself! There are movements in Islam that allow those things.
The Islamic State in Syria… Who are these people? Don't tell me that they are not Muslims. In Iraq too, they are Muslims. What ISIS does… They took children from Mount Sinjar, and raped and slaughtered them… This was done by Muslims. Should I quote from early history? It was Muslims who killed Hussein.
Rania Al-Badawi: But this is being used politically. Some countries exploit these extremists for a political end, not a religious end.
Amr Adeeb: You would not be exploited if you did not harbor this ideology. How come they do not exploit other religions? How come only the Muslims do those things?
This is a war of ideology, not of weapons.
Rania Al-Badawi: Unemployment causes terrorism…
Amr Adeeb: Okay…
Rania Al-Badawi: Dysfunctional families cause terrorism…
Amr Adeeb: And this too is an international conspiracy!?
Rania Al-Badawi: I didn't say that it was an international conspiracy. Nobody said that.
Amr Adeeb: Are the people in Belgium responsible for your worthless education?!
Rania Al-Badawi: Okay, but even in Belgium, where they provide the best education, people want to kill…
Amr Adeeb: It was because of their corrupt and distorted ideology, which is nurtured by corrupt sources within the religion of Islam. I'm choosing my words very carefully, but we all know the truth. Do you really want to bury your head in the sand, and blame [the West] for this?!
Rania Al-Badawi: Nobody wants to bury his head in the sand and say that they bear sole responsibility, but they are the ones who have made it worse. It could have been limited to terrorist attacks by some extremists – scattered attacks with long intervals between them. Instead, it has become a movement that has invaded the entire world. This is also the result of their nurturing of…
Amr Adeeb: And what about the people who killed Hussein?
Rania Al-Badawi: I'm not disputing you. By God, I'm not.
Amr Adeeb: Three of the righteous caliphs were killed while praying!
Rania Al-Badawi: I'm not disputing you…
Amr Adeeb: Did Belgium kill them or England? Or maybe it was done by the CIA?
How come you don't see Jewish terrorists?
Rania Al-Badawi: What about the Zionists?
Amr Adeeb: That's different. I'm talking about religion. You are talking about Israeli nationals, but I'm talking about Jewish groups… Do you see a Jew going around shooting people, anywhere in the world? Do you see Christians groups shooting people?
Rania Al-Badawi: We must draw a distinction. You and I are Muslims, and we don't go around shooting people. Let's stay calm. I agree with you that there is extremism in all religions…
Amr Adeeb: We are only ones who express this violently.